Your welcome Mike, I hope this form will allow you to get these feelings out. What has been done is done, we can only hope that medical caregivers will learn from their mistkaes. Abuse is rampant in some Nursing Homes, but that is another subject, not for this form. I sincerly hope this will begin some healing for you. You are reaching out

Hello Ron, Mike and all others who have posted to this thread. I had followed the Kirkbridebuildings.com over the years off and on... and just yesterday stumbled across this thread. I've not been able to stop reading (except to eat, sleep, and go to work) and just now finished the 32nd page...

I'm so glad that this forum was here for you, I'm sure Ethan never imagined his idea of a Kirkbride building forum being so instrumental in someone's healing and sorting out their past.

I too will be looking for the publication of the book and also want to thank you for helping me better understand, as best as I can imagine, what such an experience was like.

The buildings were/are beautiful... it amazes me to read the personal accounts of the kinds of terribly ugly things that truly happened there...

I just want to start by saying Hello to you all. I want to thank you Ron and Mike for opening your minds and hearts to all of us who have been absolutely pulled in and rivited to the forum just to see what the next post will bring. I grew up in Ellsworth, MI (most people don't even know it exists, but it's about 45 miles north of TC and about 5miles off US 31 ). I'm only 33, but remember TCSH still operating when I was young, and remember it closing. I took a tour with my parents when I was in high school and just the overwhelming feeling of heartache, pain and misery was almost unbearable. I went to college (the 1st time) at NMC and remember at the time (94-95) NMC Campus Security was for some reason responsible for patrolling the grounds and I remember going with a friend out there while he patrolled and it was really creepy. I'm going back to college in the winter and plan on persuing a Bachelors in Social Work (and probably a masters eventually) and I am grateful to be able to have this sort of information to learn from and use to help people. Thanks so much again, I am truely deeply sorry for all the abuse and torture that you and all the other patients endured.

Hey - regarding the question about how girls were treated at TCSH, go back to Amy's input on Sept. 8, posted by Mike. As she said, the teenage girls were being raped by a doctor that worked there, and when finally punished, all he got was a transfer to the male ward. It was odd to me how that revelation was virtually ignored on this forum. That inspired me to join and post here.

As for taking the girls hairspray, etc. away, I'm sure it was unpleasant due to society's pressure on girls to make themselves up, but I seriously doubt it mattered much compared to the rape, molesting, physical and emotional abuse they endured. It's a safe bet that it happened more to the girls than the boys. Hence, the wrist-slitting. I am curious if while Ron & Mike were there that they heard about the abuse happening to the girls.

Ron's book is, as he said, his story of his experiences there. I can't wait to read it! The experience of the girls at TCSH needs to be told, as well. Not necessarily in Ron's book but in some forum. And, if addressed in Ron's book, I hope more is mentioned than the removal of make-up and hairspray privileges. That creates the impression to the reader that the girls experience was much rosier than it was. Hopefully Amy or some woman who was there will continue to share her experiences.

regarding the question about how girls were treated at TCSH

Things were so hush hush at TCSH that I could not tell with any truth what went on in Hall-7. I do suspect the rape claim by a Doctor, The only Doctor who was there was Dr. Thill until his replacement by Dr. Mildred Herkner. late 1969 or early 1970. I believe Mike and I would have heard something if this happened. All I can tell you is what I seen or heard at school. I do not even know if any male attendants were on Hall-7. I do not know the layout or their rules. I do not know their meds or how seclusion was. I do recall once that one day no girls came to school, this was a quiet day. I do not recall why thou.

I did try to get Amy and 1 other to say more but lips are still sealed. I feel in time some girls may show up when the word gets out about what we are doing here in these forums.

The only thing I know about the other halls is what I've seen or heard, which was not very much. Like the girls wearing bandages and ragged clothes and a few other things I've mentioned.
The silence there was so saturated that everyone had the habit of looking over their shoulder before answering a question, including myself.

It would be nice if Amy could come forward and give some more insight on Hall#7. I'm curious myself.
I'm still surfing the web and checking other forums for anyone interested or who may have spent time there.

"WELCOME" to the forum Kerby!

mkfarnam wrote:"WELCOME" to the forum Kerby!

Thanks ! ! I've also been searching the internet for other personal accounts people have reported about their stay in such places. It's interesting reading some accounts of staff as well... obviously each hospital would have differences, but the similarities in the kinds of treatment patients during the time of overcrowding suffered in such facilities is horrific... I can only imagin less than 1% of the truth will ever be told.

I know a lady who was a young nurse in the 1960's in the State Hospital in Independence, Iowa. She's a very nice lady and a great school nurse. I asked her, right before she retired as the school nurse where I teach about her experiences at Independence and showed her pictures from this website that Ethan has taken on his visits to Iowa. She just seemed sad and apologetic about what happened there. She acted as if her whole experience there was a tragedy. She said it was amaizing she stayed in nursing after working there for a short while. That was my first personal "ah ha" moment that the rumors about the kinds of things that went on behind those big doors in the magnificant buildings out in the country where most people only drove by and wondered about...

I hope more people decide to share their experiences as well... both for the education and greater knowledge of those of us who have been unaware for so long, as well as for the benefit of healing and being able to move on in ones life of those sharing!

In the 1950s, those with mental illnesses were seen as societal misfits and were, consequently, jailed. The prison system became stressed and, as a result, the government issued funding for the creation of mental health asylums and hospitals. It is more then mere coincidence that such facilities were constructed directly next to state penitentiaries.

As mental health hospitals cropped up along the eastern coast, the mental health population was transferred from jails to asylums. Yet something was still wrong; the focus was still on simply removing the individuals from society. In the opinion of many practitioners,
 

"This is the exact impression tcsh gave me" the purpose of State hospitals was, to a large extent, to warehouse humans rather than to treat mental illnesses.

Even for the most well-intentioned facilities treatment was largely an impossibility; the staff to patient ratio was incredibly imbalanced, meaning stabilization, rather than treatment and progression, became the priority

http://ezinearticles.com/?State-Mental- ... id=2620735

Today I wrote another luney tune , lol, it sort of wrote itself.
Hey
http://www.hall-18.com/mp3/Hey.mp3

ronl wrote:Today I wrote another luney tune , lol, it sort of wrote itself.
Hey
http://www.hall-18.com/mp3/Hey.mp3

Nice work Ron....
I'm putting together a video/slide show with all of the pictures on this thread and those who posted them,(with their permission of course), along with other picture of tcsh I've found on the web. I'm still in the begining stage, but I'm going to need some background music. Maybe when I'm finished I'll send it to you for the final touch. ..

Wonderful song Ron - I found it very touching & also sad. Thanks for sharing it.
Sandi

Mike I am writing a new CD with 12 songs and I am at song 7 now, to go along with the book, titled the same "Where Buffalo Roam"
You can use any of my music on your slide show, but music is a big space eater, my MP3's are about 3 MB's each, if they were a wave file than they would be 30 MB's each.
You can listen to them all @ http://www.hall-18.com

It been a week since I last posted, I just cannot think of anything that has not been un-covered and talked about. I wish you would ask new questions, maybe I can get new old memories.

Today it raining here in Florida and I took the time to listen to the audio posted about the hospital "Point North" and I heard 3 former patients talk, I could feel their pain and I knew what they were saying in silence behind their words. Hearing them speak I felt I knew them.

During my time at TCSH I was exposed to many national tragedy's, Like when Martin Luther King was killed and Bobby Kennedy. I remember the Vietnam War everyday on TV, I recall the riots in our city's and the Beatles breaking up. The man on the moon ........ and what depressed me the most was the passing of Walt Disney.

ronl where do you find the posting for former patients? I Google for them , but am unable to find any. I have never heard of North Point. Is in in Michigan? I wish others that were were at TCSH would post....but I understnd their misgivings about doing do. The stigma is alive and well today:( Unless the word is out, the abuse will continue. So very sad. I still admire you and the other (Mike) for having the courgage to come forward:) Thank you!